Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: You're not broken. Your body is trying to tell you something. Your body is trying to help you get the balance that you need so it can be healthy. We need to start understanding that the symptoms that we have, they can cause us a lot of grief and suffering and struggle, but they're a way for our body to communicate with us.
[00:00:22] Speaker B: Hi, I'm Deborah Rosman, and a warm welcome to our listeners each month for the Ad Heart podcast, I have the privilege of interviewing individuals who are contributing to the creation of a more heart based world.
This month I'm talking with Doctor Jerina Elvers, a neurologist who specializes in helping people heal from chronic stress and trauma.
Jerrina worked at Stanford Children's Hospital as a pediatric neurologist and is currently the director of the Heartmath Institute's Trauma Recovery Project.
She created Heartmath's Resilient Heart program for trauma, which has helped thousands of people relieve symptoms and suffering from trauma. It includes trauma focused video content, including the neurophysiology of trauma, developmental trauma, collective trauma, and how to integrate heart men's tools to help release trauma. Welcome, Jerina.
[00:01:26] Speaker A: Thank you so much. It's a pleasure to be here. Debbie.
[00:01:31] Speaker B: You know, this is such a timely issue and we really want to give people some of the hope we're seeing. You and I recently wrote an article that's available in Heart Mass October connections newsletter on why today's stress is different and what's called secondary trauma that many of us experienced from all the exposure to the traumatic events going on in the world. Through the news, our social media feeds, other people's stories, we are being deeply impacted by constant, sensationalized, often by the media trauma inputs, simply by opening our smartphones, and we can become numb to the stress of it all. But it is taking a toll on our personal and collective mental health. And I love something you wrote, which was like the frog who doesn't jump out of slowly boiling water. We're adapting to ongoing stress and trauma and perceiving it as normal without recognizing its negative impact.
So love for you to say more about what you're seeing in this, especially from your medical practice, in seeing patients these days.
[00:02:41] Speaker A: Yeah, great, great. Well, thanks for that great introduction, Debbie. You know, I think we.
I think stress is normal. Stress is a normal part of our existence, right? And I don't think there's been a time in history where stress hasn't been an important part of resilience, an important part of building strength, an important part of pushing us to do things differently to come up with new ways of agriculture and the industrial revolution.
We've done these things as a result of things that haven't been going well and the stress that it puts on us. And we know that a certain amount of stress is good for our performance.
Sometimes we do better on a test. Sometimes we'll do better at competition when we have that stress. But stress is also stealthy, and stress has a way of activating us. And when we're not able to release the stress or resolve the stress, from the moment when the next stressor comes in, it accumulates on top of the past stress. So the way I kind of talk about it with my patients is like a defibrillator. So, you know, you see them in the movies, these things that start the heart up again, right? And so you see them, like, charging it up. Charge. And then you hear this, like, it charges it. And then they go to the patient and clear in this big discharge. So our nervous system is designed for that. We have a part of our autonomic nervous system, a system that's running in the background called fight or flight. And when we're activated, it's like we get supercharged, like that defibrillator, and then there's a discharge, a release of that energy for fight sometimes, or flight or creation or movement or something, right? So it's moving us to do something. It's a mobilizing force.
But when we don't have that discharge, when we don't have that mobilization, with the stress that people are experiencing at work, at home, there's these stressors that are happening in the world where we're exposed to news and war and poverty and political divisiveness, school shootings, mass shootings. I mean, it just. The list goes on and on. So these, as we're reading them, they activate our nervous system. But the difference between stress and trauma is that when trauma is basically an extreme form of stress, that causes overwhelm in the nervous system. So that system gets supercharged like that defibrillator. But what happens is there's so much stress that we end up like a circuit breaker. So, you know, when you're in the kitchen, you got the microwave going, the toaster going, the something else going, and then all of a sudden, you blow a fuse.
That is the circuit breaker, and that's trauma. So it's a shutdown. It shuts down our emotional. It can shut down our body. We can get numb, physically numb, emotionally numb, mentally numb. And that's what happens when something is so overwhelming for us. We don't have the ability to cope with it, and there's a shutdown. So what's happening is we have all of this sort of baseline level of stress that's activating our system. We may or may not have an outlet for that system.
And then on top of that, we have these horrendous images in the news, these horrendous stories, and we don't know how to cope with that. And we're not directly affected by it, but we are because we're reading about it or it's affecting us, and then what we do is we'll just shut it off. It's like that light switch. I don't want to deal with this because it's too overwhelming for me.
[00:06:59] Speaker B: Yeah, that is going on so much throughout the world, not just in developed countries. I was just amazed. The National Geographic magazine had a June 2024 issue, talked about a global mental health crisis in adults and teens. But they said the consequences of a global, broad scale increase in stress is only beginning to be appreciated. But the evidence suggests we're facing a second pandemic of mood and anxiety disorders, including major depression, anxiety and PTSD. Post traumatic stress disorder, because the cumulative stress is taking its toll. Like you said, we can become numb to it because we think that's the way it is. That can lead to increased cynicism and loss of hope, to changes in our beliefs and attitudes about the world, fueling maybe the rise today of conspiracy theories and political extremism. Gosh, you're finding that underlying a lot of this accumulation, which we can't control, is a dysregulated nervous system, but perhaps we can control that in response. Can you tell us what that is and what you're finding?
[00:08:17] Speaker A: Yeah. So, you know, as we talked about earlier, stress is stealthy. And we know we're stressed. We can say, yeah, I'm really stressed. But we're not really making the connection between our stress level and what's happening in our body.
And that's kind of where stress is allowed to accumulate, because we're not making that connection between our stress level, our job stress, our home stress, the fact that we can't make rent, we might be evicted. I mean, these are huge, huge stressors that many people are facing. And what we do is what we end up having is headaches. Headaches are real common, more socially acceptable form of stress. I would say migraines. Right? People might say, yeah, I'm really stressed. I get migraines. But, Debbie, there's a whole slew of physical symptoms that result from accumulated stress. Digestive problems, sleep problems, brain fog.
We can get heart palpitations, shortness of breath.
People can sometimes get really sensitive skin and eczema.
Stress starts to build up in the system, and because the nervous system is the interface between our outside world and our inside world, it's the foundation for all of the things that happen inside the body. When our nervous system is activated in a stress response all the time, it starts to affect the other systems. It starts to affect our heart. It starts to affect our breathing. It starts to affect our digestion, our ability to think clearly. So what we end up with is a dysregulated system. A dysregulated nervous system that's a either in fight or flight, all the time it's trying to come down and go into rest and repair. But then we have the trauma response, which is shutting everything down. So what we kind of end up is we're driving a car with the gas and the brake on at the same time, and it doesn't, you know, that doesn't bode well for the car. When we start to have wear and tear on the cardinal, that's when we start to think about this dysregulated nervous system that our system is trying to accommodate the stress, trying to manage a homeostatic baseline. So a baseline in the body that's adapting to a normal state, but with the next round of stress or trauma, it gets activated all over again. And so all the systems that are trying to do their job, our digestive system is a great example. When we're stressed, the digestive system, it's in a fight or flight mode. So when we're running away from a tiger, we're not digesting our food.
Constipation is very common in a chronic stress state. Now, then, if you have trauma on top of that, an overwhelmed system is actually the opposite side of the nervous system. It's a parasympathetic system, and that creates diarrhea.
Then we have constipation and diarrhea that can alternate. You can be in a super stressed state, and then you might shift into your trauma, overwhelm, shutdown state, and back and forth between these two. Well, what do a lot of people have? Irritable bowel syndrome. What is that? It's an alternating form of constipation, diarrhea. So we need to start understanding that the symptoms that we have are not, you know, they can cause us a lot of grief and suffering and struggle, but they're a way for our body to communicate with us. And I tell this to every single one of my patients, you're not broken.
Your body is trying to tell you something. Your body is trying to help you get the balance that you need so it can be healthy. Your migraine is a signal of dysregulation for you to recognize that you're dysregulated and for you to start making some changes. And that's a very different message than what many people get in the healthcare system. Take this triptan takes this prophylactic, or, well, you have all these different medical symptoms, and we don't know the tests are all normal because we're not testing the right thing. Right? We're testing a picture of the brain or an electrophysiology of the heart, and everything looks normal. But underneath the hood, we have a dysregulated nervous system, and there's no test for that. There's just a whole lot of symptoms. We haven't figured it out yet. So even the medical system is missing the connection between chronic stress and the symptoms that people are experiencing.
[00:13:26] Speaker B: Even though it's well known that 80 to five to 90% of visits to primary care physicians are stress related, they know conceptually stress is somewhere underneath that. But it's amazing how many people have come so adapted to stress. We've discovered this over the years, training. They don't think they have stress, or it's just minor, it's just normal. And yet it doesn't even have to be the kind of major stressors that used to be the divorce or can't pay the bills. It's like I'm running from morning to night. Elder care, kid care, perfectionism, trying to get stuff done at work. I mean, the pressures that seem unavoidable, and yet that can dysregulate the nervous system. You once told me a story that you had a patient who had been to all sorts of doctors for all these symptoms, and how relieved he felt when you were able to point to the dysregulated nervous system, that there was something he could do something about. And I think that's what people are yearning for in the hope is, you know, it's time for us all to wake up to the seriousness of what's going on for ourselves, our young people who are suffering from stress and the same kind of secondary trauma, finding effective ways to start helping ourselves and each other. And as you know, while you're working with Heartmath is why. Heartmath has been researching stress for the past 30 years. And designing self empowerment techniques to give people tools to build their own inner self management, self empowerment skills so they can re regulate their nervous system and feel more confident in their ability to handle what's going on. So again, the science based heart rhythm coherence techniques and technologies are specifically designed to help people regulate reset, as we say, the heart rhythm, the nervous system, the emotions to help release stress and trauma. And I know you're using these techniques and heartbath technology and it's giving people hope. Can you give us some examples?
What are you finding?
[00:15:36] Speaker A: Well, I mean, so when someone comes to see me, that's one of the top things that we know. We always talk about stress and trauma and how those things may be impacting them. And so building awareness is always the first thing that I do. And then part of that awareness is recognizing when you're dysregulated. So what does that look like for you? Oh, I noticed that I get, my heart starts racing, my stomach gets really tight, I get really angry.
It's always, you know, it's often this particular trigger. So building awareness around what that looks like for you and then giving people a tool, what can you do in that moment? Instead of getting upset, instead of leaving the situation, you know, unresolved or undiscussed, instead of shutting down, what can you do instead? And so every patient comes with, I teach them these heart math techniques for when those moments happen.
Can you break the cycle? Because the nervous system learns through experience.
So taking a pill isn't going to change the nervous system.
Changing your response to a stressor to, and that level of activation and choosing a different response instead of getting upset and activated, I'm going to take a moment to do five big breaths through my heart and then I'm going to be able to respond from a different place. That's how we shift the dysregulation within the nervous system and we start to move it towards regulation.
That in the moment piece is critical for breaking the cycle and giving the system new input. So taking it from dysregulation into regulation through that heart focus breathing technique.
And then I also do a stress inventory. And I do ask for people to do five minutes or ten minutes of just practice at least once a day where they're just practicing with that breathing technique, that heart focused breathing, they can put on some nice calming music or be in their garden or in their favorite chair and just doing that breathing just again to overlay that, that regulation in their nervous system and give it, you know, some people meditate. So it's along those same lines of giving the system a different input of regulation throughout the day, rather than just the dysregulation that they're used to.
[00:18:29] Speaker B: And what do you hear from your patients? What new perspectives cause again, the heart mount tools are designed to get heart, brain and nervous system in sync, which often provides a totally new perspective.
[00:18:43] Speaker A: Yeah, well, that's really the fun part, is when I, when I see patients back after giving them this advice. So for, you know, it's just like anything, though, if you don't do it, it's not gonna work.
So I really tell people upfront, you have to try, like, really make a concerted effort three times between now when I see you again, to really try to break the cycle. So people are really, when they come back, they say, you know what? This really works. This really helped me. Instead of getting mad at my son, at the XYZ, instead of blowing up at my partner, instead of getting road rage, I did my breathing and I connected to my heart. And so the things that I hear are, I felt more calm, I felt more like my head was clearer, I made a better decision. I didn't get so upset. And then invariably, people start to recognize the more they use it, the more energy they have through the day, because they're not wasting all their energy on their dysregulated system and on getting upset. And so it takes a little bit of energy in order to implement it and that conscious awareness and that building awareness. But once they start doing it and using it on a regular basis, things make really a big shift. And they have more energy, they're more resilient to the stressors coming in. They find their relationships are better and, you know, they just think more clearly. Things start to shift in their life in ways that they didn't necessarily anticipate. So it's really fun when people really start to use these techniques and the magic starts to happen.
[00:20:39] Speaker B: Yeah. You know, you've mentioned breathing, but heart mouth is, I mean, that's just a start, you know, for balancing. But it's really about the qualities of the heart. The power to weather the storms and greater emotional stability lies within each of our own hearts. So it's time for more self kindness and compassionate care for ourselves to help release stress and trauma. What do you find as far as the heart qualities for people developing that kind of emotional well being?
[00:21:14] Speaker A: Yeah. So I find that it depends on the person in the situation. So sometimes people are so overwhelmed and overloaded that coming up with something they can appreciate in the moment, right, using that and adding that. So I usually start with the breathing technique, and then I lay on the. The heart frequency, appreciation, care, gratitude, kindness. And some people can't get to that emotional shift right away. And so I always preface that, and I say, it's okay if you can't get there, because, you know, when you're really, especially if there's been a lot of trauma that just expecting you can get to appreciation is a big leap. And so can you just breathe and get to neutral?
Can you breathe in a feeling of ease? Can you just sit and feel the sun on your face? Can you imagine sitting in a place that feels good for you or feels a little more calming? And so sometimes it's the smaller bite sized pieces of shifting people in their frequency just a little bit. And from there, they're more likely to be able to, you know, generate that feeling of appreciation. But it doesn't always happen right away. And sometimes people's minds are really busy, right? That anxiety, that self talk, they can be really preoccupied in those, those, you know, all of that noise can really be overpowering. And so if people are having a hard time trying to settle the mind as they're doing their breathing technique, then I recommend some nice, soft music or bilateral music that's also very regulating. And I pair that with the heart focused breathing. If they can't get there with the heart focused breathing on its own, wow.
[00:23:16] Speaker B: It's learning to really know where your client, your patient is and learning to know where you are. Because some days, it's easier to feel gratitude than others. Other days, it's easier to just feel, be kind to myself, what can I do to feel that? Or just breathe calm? We have that in one of our tools called attitude breathing and attitude replacement. Find something that helps shift it. So why don't we do a heart meditation on this now together? And from what you've said, what we've shared, people can focus in the heart. We'll do some heart focused breathing, and then breathe in whatever heart quality, from calmness to ease to love to kindness that you can generally feel. So let's focus on the heart.
Pretend the breath is flowing in and out of the heart or chest area. Breathing a little slower, a little deeper than normal.
Just find an easy rhythm that's comfortable as you continue this heart focused breathing.
Breathe in the heart. Qualities that you can feel, whether it's love or compassion, care, appreciation, or just calmness or ease and help you get still in your heart.
And as you breathe out, radiate out, that heart quality into your mental, emotional and physical systems.
See your heart, brain and nervous system aligning in harmony and coherence. As you do this now, envision yourself practicing this simple exercise of heart focused breathing. A heart quality that you can genuinely adopt or feel.
Kindness, appreciation, compassion, love, gratitude. It doesn't matter which, because heart qualities bring our nervous system back to balance and coherence and nurture us.
Envision yourself when you get triggered or overwhelmed, just simply giving yourself a minute to shift and practice.
It helps to release stress or despair, release inner loneliness is your heart. Warmth brings lift in spirit, and it's really the heart connection with ourselves that heals and creates a new baseline for handling the challenges of today and for our mental and physical health.
Another thing that can help, which we'll do together now, is radiate our collective heart energy, our compassion, kindness, love, to all the people and nations on the planet suffering from stress and trauma, political divisiveness, wars, natural disasters, all those major stressors. We radiate that heart energy, that coherent, harmonious heart quality into the environment. It helps balance our system, and research is showing it helps others.
[00:28:10] Speaker A: It.
[00:28:49] Speaker B: Now, let's close by radiating and co creating a reservoir of kind and compassionate heart energy, a pool of energy that each of us can tap into over the next month when we need a lift in spirit or clarity or support to handle whatever challenges we're going through and feel more inspired by our own inner guidance. Let's create that reservoir together and know from many people sharing that it's real. You can pause and do the heart meditation and tap into it for a pickup.
Thank you so much for sharing in that heart meditation and attending today. Jerina, is there anything else you'd like to share with our listeners?
[00:30:17] Speaker A: Yeah, I think the last thing, as we were talking about trauma is just to help people understand that there is pretty good help out there now that things like EMDR, things like brain spotting, somatic work, there's really good ways that we can help that overwhelm and that system that's been in shutdown. And I think that people can get discouraged by cognitive behavioral therapy or talk therapy when they're dealing with trauma. And so finding a professional who's really comfortable working with trauma and potentially using one of those methods, there's more help out there than you think.
[00:31:07] Speaker B: Thank you for sharing that. And I also want to encourage people, if you want to view the video course that Jerina created. The Resilient Heart program was created for health professionals because there's so much of this trauma going on. We open it up to individuals who want to learn more about trauma and learn some simple heartmath tools they can use. You can go to heartmath.com or heartmath.org and just enter the resilient heart.
And I also want to say there's also at either website Interactive Heartmath experience online video course that you can download for free. And there's an amazing new Heartmath app in your heart app store, a lot of resources, so please feel free to check it out. And I want to remind you that the third Tuesday of every month, we publish a new episode of the Sad Heart podcast with a new guest. So be sure you subscribe and don't miss our next guest and topic.
Thank you, Jerina. Thank you everyone and take care.
[00:32:20] Speaker A: Thank you. It was great to be here.
[00:32:23] Speaker C: Thank you for listening to the ad Heart podcast. Be sure to subscribe so you can catch the latest episodes. If you're wanting even more heart inspired content, find us on Facebook, Instagram, YouTube and LinkedIn. Look for Heartmath and also the Heartmath Institute. Both organizations are committed to helping activate the heart of humanity.
